DLC Content Replacing In-Game Content

That_One_DudeThat_One_Dude Banned
edited December 2007 in Rock Band
I think for every single song you download you should get the choice to remove one song from the main setlist and for every pack, you get 3 more choices.

Let's say I downloaded the Black Sabbath pack, but I wanted to take out Green Grass and High Tides, Dead on Arrival, and Maps. I would just play the other three instead of those.

I think as long as it always comes out to 58 songs, it would be fine.

This should be applicable in every game mode except online play of course.

The only problem would be the tier levels, and to adjust that let's say that Maps is a first tier and Sweet Leaf is a first tier, perhaps to replace songs just make it so that the song replacing it has to be the same tier or the final result has to end up with 5 songs in every tier like normal.

Comments

  • Teh_Nfsjunkie91Teh_Nfsjunkie91 Rising Star
    edited December 2007
    People would download easy songs, replaces hard songs, and would destroy the balance of BWT mode.
  • That_One_DudeThat_One_Dude Banned
    edited December 2007
    But the people who did this would be technically penalized since they can't get as high a score by taking out the "harder" songs. And that's why I recommended the tier idea. People removing Highway Star should be forced to put in something such as Ride the Lightning to make up for it.

    Please read the entire post next time :)
  • teh_rocteh_roc Opening Act
    edited December 2007
    Lame, the whole point of DLC is to get more, not to have a static number of songs availible.
  • Assault420Assault420 Opening Act
    edited December 2007
    Simply do not download hard songs if you can not play them yes? Dude your argument just does not make any sense at all. The point of DLC is to have more songs. I am up to 80 songs, and would not have it any other way. 55 songs is still what you only need to beat to see the end credits. The DLC songs are there to add more replay value.
  • That_One_DudeThat_One_Dude Banned
    edited December 2007
    What the hell is the guy above blabbering about?

    I never said there is any trouble with beating harder songs, but when and if we get up to the hundreds of songs in a playlist there will be undesirable songs you and others may just not wish to play. This never had anything to do with difficulty and if that's a problem I posted a solution (must replace higher tier original songs with higher tier downloadble songs)

    And this is an opinion. If your opinion of having 80 songs to play is fun and you like all of them, more power to you. A real band does in fact get to pick what they play, and their nightly gigs do not consist of 80 "static" songs, but instead a very shorter amount of songs.

    Also, there are only 45 songs in the game, not counting the bonus ones. I'm starting to wonder if you read my post at all either or have even played the game...
  • JamesGarrJamesGarr Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    I think you've got a good idea Dude.

    The only objection I've seen to taking default songs out of BWT is that it's unfair for some people to be able to play easier songs, but if easier songs make your score lower that makes sense to me.

    The other side of it is that replacing easier songs with harder ones can help some gain higher scores in BWT. I don't have a problem with that.

    So it seems like this would make it possible to remove songs from mystery setlists that you don't want to play, and replace them with things you like in a balanced way that rewards those who pay for DLC. Sounds great...
  • Amish RobotAmish Robot Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    Teh_Nfsjunkie91;186491 said:
    People would download easy songs, replaces hard songs, and would destroy the balance of BWT mode.
    I disagree with this completely. Lower tier songs= less points, less money, less fans. Reduce these, and increase the time investment needed to achieve what you want. It's just a different form of balance.

    I'd even go one further and say that rather than replacing songs with DLC, there should be the ability to disable any songs you don't want entirely. The tracklist for the game is great, but no matter how good there will always be a song or two the player doesn't like and that song instantly becomes a chore. There are a couple songs that I absolutely hate (no names, as I don't want to start any arguments), and when I hit them the game becomes a level-grind more than anything else. Outside of unlocking or working my way through the tiers, I will stop the game and restart when those songs come up.

    This becomes more of an issue with the unlockable songs. There are some great songs there, but I can't choose which ones I like and unlocking the ones I want forces some I dislike intensely into the song list.

    The enjoyment of the game comes from playing along with the songs. The progression in BWT is simply a meta-game for added incentive, and if you don't like the songs it becomes moot.
  • GrevinatorGrevinator Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    I agree with the notion that songs should be able to be taken out/replaced in a playlist in differant areas ofthe game not including career mode. Career mode unfortunately would need to stay the same for fairness purposes becasue no matter how you look at it, one song is not equal to another. However, replacing songs in World Tours would be an awesome feature, its basicly creating your own in game playlists based on the sognd that you personally download and want to play/sing while eliminating the songs we all hate (Maps).

    :)
  • That_One_DudeThat_One_Dude Banned
    edited December 2007
    JamesGarr;186538 said:
    I think you've got a good idea Dude.

    The only objection I've seen to taking default songs out of BWT is that it's unfair for some people to be able to play easier songs, but if easier songs make your score lower that makes sense to me.

    The other side of it is that replacing easier songs with harder ones can help some gain higher scores in BWT. I don't have a problem with that.

    So it seems like this would make it possible to remove songs from mystery setlists that you don't want to play, and replace them with things you like in a balanced way that rewards those who pay for DLC. Sounds great...
    Yep, you and Amish actually seem to be getting my points.

    This system rewards people who help expand their library and put a little extra in Harmonix's pockets but doesn't really penalize people who don't (besides not being able to get at the top of the band's leaderboards because they didn't buy every song, not that I see anyone passing the College Dropouts anytime soon :P) Even if you did buy every song, the band world tour leaderboard is based on points and fans and if it takes them 8 minutes to play a one million point song, you could easily play another song two or three times and make up for it so the DLC would make virtually no difference at all.

    I also agree with the letting the solo mode stay the same since you are right about the no song being the same as another, Amish. I think with a few tweaks, having a set playlist of 45 songs for your virtual band to play would be amazing and hopefully other people will see this.
  • Amish RobotAmish Robot Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    Good point regarding solo tour. Since that's a linear progression in terms of difficulty and the primary method for unlocking harder songs, I would have no problem with leaving that untouched and allowing to disable songs only for quickplay and BWT. It would be nice, though, if we could assign band members for quickplay. (hint, hint!) :)
  • UltraceUltrace Road Warrior
    edited December 2007
    It's a shame that people dislike certain songs so much that they would want to remove them from their BWT experience completely. But the simple fact remains, there are always songs that bands come to dislike for a number of reasons but they play anyway because it's what the fans want to hear. While RB is hardly the epitome of realism, it does try at times to simulate a band feel in BWT, and that's what you're getting here. Someone doesn't like Dead on Arrival or Green Grass and High Tides? Sorry to hear it, but deal with it--it's part of the game as the designers made and envisioned it.

    Just because someone buys additional content for the game, that doesn't entitle them to change the balance of gameplay by swapping out levels and such. RB might be revolutionary in several ways, but it still adheres to a lot of gaming standards and one of those is that outside of hacking, you don't get to alter the campaign mode as developers made it.
  • UltraceUltrace Road Warrior
    edited December 2007
    Amish Robot;186584 said:
    I would have no problem with leaving that untouched and allowing to disable songs only for quickplay and BWT. It would be nice, though, if we could assign band members for quickplay. (hint, hint!) :)
    Why would you want to disable songs for quickplay? Since that's entirely driven by what you choose, there shouldn't seem to be any reason to remove songs from the list... Unless you're referring to online play and want to somehow prevent someone else from choosing a song you don't like...
  • Amish RobotAmish Robot Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    Ultrace;186672 said:
    Why would you want to disable songs for quickplay? Since that's entirely driven by what you choose, there shouldn't seem to be any reason to remove songs from the list... Unless you're referring to online play and want to somehow prevent someone else from choosing a song you don't like...
    It may seem silly, but In a few months when the DLC starts padding out people's song lists to 100+ tracks, that's a lot of scrolling. At that point 10-20 songs you'll never play anyway will start to get annoying.

    Although maybe a better idea than disabling songs in quickplay would be the ability to create custom playlists for it.
  • GenchiGenchi Unsigned
    edited December 2007
    It may seem silly, but In a few months when the DLC starts padding out people's song lists to 100+ tracks, that's a lot of scrolling.
    That's why you can sort the list. WIth sorting you barely have to scroll at all. Just highlight a song with the same first letter/from the same band/in the same genre/in the same tier as the song you want and then sort to the applicable filter. I do think being able to sort by song type would be helpful though (standard, bonus and download).

    As for the original post, I think it sort of defeats what little difficulty there is in World Tour. From a game design standard I think it'd be an awful feature. If you can just remove all of the stuff you're no good at or simply don't like it defeats the whole purpose of having a mystery setlist to being with.
    This system rewards people who help expand their library and put a little extra in Harmonix's pockets but doesn't really penalize people who don't
    That's a good thing. You SHOULDN'T be penalized for not buying extra content (though Microsoft seems to think otherwise).

    Guitar Hero 2 and GH3 have that problem (as do the solo instrument leaderboards). People who buy DLC can get a higher career score than someone who doesn't simply because they have access to more songs. It makes it a lot harder to take the leaderboards seriously because you can't tell if the people close to you are there because they're at the same skill level or if it's just because they've got three times as many songs to play as you.

    It's already been pointed out, but the idea behind doing a mystery setlist is that the crowd is supposed to pick what songs you play. Obviously a video game, like Rock Band, isn't meant to emulate EXACTLY what it's like to tour in a band, but I've known people who play in bands and they DO get tired of playing some of their songs so frequently, but if it's what the crowd wants it's what the crowd wants. With a few exceptions, most of the non-downloadable songs aren't the long. Unless you dislike most of the setlist (or you just get unlucky) having to play through one song you don't like isn't the end of the world.

    There were a few songs in the guitar hero games that I just plain didn't like, and there were other songs where I didn't like the music, but enjoyed the note charts. If you get a song you don't like find some way to make it more interesting to play. Try using the solo frets for the solo (if you don't normally), try playing with lefty flip (if it's an easy song), try to see how long you can, as a band, keep overdrive activated (by 'chaining' with the other instruments and hitting all of the unison bonuses) or whatever else you can come up with.

    Besides, in order to play World Tour you're, generally, supposed to have friends in the room playing with you. If you get a song that you all hate find some way to make it fun. It should be easy with good friends. Having cool friends around tends to make even the most mundane things entertaining.
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