So this is basically like the song creator in GH4 but 10x better.

RiddycalRiddycal Opening Act
edited October 2009 in The Rock Band Network

Comments

  • Felldoh_The_SquirrelFelldoh_The_Squirrel Road Warrior
    edited August 2009
    Yes, exactly. ;) It's gonna be so awesome now that we get actually well made stuff, instead of random junk that is unreasonably hard like on GH.
  • SushipunkSushipunk Unsigned
    edited August 2009
    yo, if you want to be black and white about it. yeah sure!
  • afterstasisafterstasis Washed Up
    edited August 2009
    really, it's not much like the GH creator... the GH creator was just basically a really bad DAW/sampler with a few "video gamey" features and the ability to share your creations.

    RBN is the logical progression of allowing music of all shapes and sizes (whether you made it yourself with a midi controller and garage-band or recorded it in a pro studio with a 9 piece band) an opportunity to be made into a playable track in RB, not to mention allowing artists to make some cash from the downloads.
  • RiddycalRiddycal Opening Act
    edited August 2009
    afterstasis;2830726 said:
    really, it's not much like the GH creator... the GH creator was just basically a really bad DAW/sampler with a few "video gamey" features and the ability to share your creations.

    RBN is the logical progression of allowing music of all shapes and sizes (whether you made it yourself with a midi controller and garage-band or recorded it in a pro studio with a 9 piece band) an opportunity to be made into a playable track in RB, not to mention allowing artists to make some cash from the downloads.
    i know,that's why i said it's 10x better.
  • afterstasisafterstasis Washed Up
    edited August 2009
    Riddycal;2830730 said:
    i know,that's why i said it's 10x better.
    but you also stated that it's like the song creator in GH, but this isn't a song-creator at all... you bring the music on your own, and then use the service to chart and share it.

    i get what you're saying, but you'd be surprised how many people still seem to think that they're going to be playing songs that sound like GH's sampled-ringtone crap.
  • timmay9timmay9 Washed Up
    edited August 2009
    Comparing the two is dumb. They are nothing alike.
  • destruction3402destruction3402 Opening Act
    edited August 2009
    It's not 10x better, more like 1000x better.
    All you could do in GHWT was some ringtone sounding crap that you could share with others.
    In RBN, you can record a song with real instruments and equipment, and then share it, unlike GHWT.
  • ArmsAreLoudArmsAreLoud Road Warrior
    edited August 2009
    This isn't anything like the Music Studio in World Tour. This is providing the fan base with the same tools that Harmonix has; nothing more, nothing less.
  • OakTeaOakTea Road Warrior
    edited August 2009
    Except it isn't as widely usable, isn't open for free to anybody who has the game, and is probably temporarily nothing more than occasional extra DLC to PS3 and Wii users.

    That being said, it's a really great idea, and I hope it makes its way to other consoles and countries completely.
  • VedicardiVedicardi Road Warrior
    edited August 2009
    they are completely different thing.

    one makes midi songs, the other allows you to put original REAL songs into a game
  • kiggidykevkiggidykev Thinks about pandas
    edited August 2009
    The concept is similar in that it allows users that are not developers at HMX to develop song charts and distribute them online. I think the similarities end there, though. The RBN is ridiculously deeper than the GHWT song creator.
  • packerfan8675309packerfan8675309 Bladder of Steal
    edited August 2009
    OakTea;2833109 said:
    Except it isn't as widely usable, isn't open for free to anybody who has the game, and is probably temporarily nothing more than occasional extra DLC to PS3 and Wii users.

    That being said, it's a really great idea, and I hope it makes its way to other consoles and countries completely.
    Well if you go the Rhythm Authors direction it is free... They do all the work and the only thing you would pay is to get the track recorded correctly.
  • LuigiHannLuigiHann Stormtrooper
    edited August 2009
    Yeah this is really not like the song creator in GH4 at all. Completely different.
  • Ferocious QFerocious Q Headliner
    edited August 2009
    RBN is more like ITUNES in a creative sense. GHWT's music "maker" involves a very small set of prerecorded noises to self-edit. The latter is far from creative.
  • edited August 2009
    Conceptually they are both about user-generated content. But the methods of implementation are vastly different.

    They are as closely related as lightning is to a lightning bug.
  • General Lein979General Lein979 Headliner
    edited August 2009
    It's the answer the same problem, but different solutions. The problem is that people like making custom songs and their is only so much dlc we can release at a time.

    GH answer is lets give them the ability to make the songs on disc with prerecorded sounds and mash them together to make a song. Positives: Tech is on disc, anyone can do it, and songs are free. Negatives: Songs sound like ringtones.

    Harmonix's is lets give them the ability to put their own songs in the game made with real instruments using the same ramifications and tech they use. Positives: actual songs and can make an indie band gain more fans. Negatives: Cost, buy the tech, musical talent, ability to understand what your doing when you chart, and not anything goes.

    So what I'm trying to say the two things are very different and are not comparable.
  • primenay13primenay13 Opening Act
    edited August 2009
    Way better, I really don't like gh4 though
  • guarf1guarf1 Unsigned
    edited August 2009
    It will be completely different from GH4's music studio. First of all It won't be free. If you go to http://creators.rockband.com/ and look under the Review tab you will see in small print that it says that a membership will be $99/year. Secondly you will have to own the rights to the track, so you can't just download someones song and use it. It will also have to be approved by the community or the song won't be released. It will only be for Xbox Live and only select songs will be available for the PS3.
  • OddbrotherOddbrother Road Warrior
    edited August 2009
    What do you think makes it 10x better? The fact that we don't make our own music and steal someone else's just to chart 'em?
  • QuazifujiQuazifuji Opening Act
    edited August 2009
    The best way I've seen to think about it is that the difference between GHTunes and RBN is like the difference between playing Rock Band and playing a real instrument. One's a accessible and fun diversion but you generally can't get too much out of it besides entertainment, while the other requires a lot of skill, time, and money to use but is a much bigger deal and you can potentially profit from it.

    In short, Rock Band Network doesn't obsolete the GH music creator for the same reason that real instruments don't obsolete rhythm games.
    General Lein979;2853095 said:
    It's the answer the same problem, but different solutions. The problem is that people like making custom songs and their is only so much dlc we can release at a time.
    Actually, I think these are two completely different problems,that people like making custom songs, and that Harmonix/Neversoft can only make so much DLC.

    The GH music creator mainly solves the first problem. It lets anyone make and play their own little songs without much musical knowledge or skill. The ability for other people to download them helps a bit for the second problem, but the low quality of the songs produced means most of the appeal generally relies on the ability to create your own, not to download other people's songs.

    RBN exists primarilly to solve the limited DLC problem. By allowing bands to do the work themselves (or hiring someone else to do it), there will be more songs available as DLC than Harmonix could possibly chart themselves, including from bands that Harmonix has probably never even heard of. It may also satisfy the hardcore custom charters a bit, but the high barrier of entry for creating songs (money, lots of time, relatively steep learning curve, needs to be professional quality, and you need to actually have the rights to a real song) means that it's primary purpose is to increase the amount of DLC available and the ease with which bands can get into Rock Band.
    Oddbrother;2953665 said:
    What do you think makes it 10x better? The fact that we don't make our own music and steal someone else's just to chart 'em?
    You can't really steal someone else's music to chart it in RBN. I mean, you might technically be able to, but even aside from the legality issues, you'd only be able to to play it in audition mode, wouldn't be able to submit it,
  • Darth FizzDarth Fizz Opening Act
    edited August 2009
    Yea this isn't even close to comparing to GH music creator. If RB wanted to make a music creator then they would call it Rock Band Music Creator. =P Plus it sounds much cooler. I know a couple of friends in local bands around where i live that would like to have their music put on here. :D
  • Lunar_SavageLunar_Savage Unsigned
    edited September 2009
    Quazifuji;2956129 said:
    The best way I've seen to think about it is that the difference between GHTunes and RBN is like the difference between playing Rock Band and playing a real instrument. One's a accessible and fun diversion but you generally can't get too much out of it besides entertainment, while the other requires a lot of skill, time, and money to use but is a much bigger deal and you can potentially profit from it.

    In short, Rock Band Network doesn't obsolete the GH music creator for the same reason that real instruments don't obsolete rhythm games.



    Actually, I think these are two completely different problems,that people like making custom songs, and that Harmonix/Neversoft can only make so much DLC.

    The GH music creator mainly solves the first problem. It lets anyone make and play their own little songs without much musical knowledge or skill. The ability for other people to download them helps a bit for the second problem, but the low quality of the songs produced means most of the appeal generally relies on the ability to create your own, not to download other people's songs.

    RBN exists primarilly to solve the limited DLC problem. By allowing bands to do the work themselves (or hiring someone else to do it), there will be more songs available as DLC than Harmonix could possibly chart themselves, including from bands that Harmonix has probably never even heard of. It may also satisfy the hardcore custom charters a bit, but the high barrier of entry for creating songs (money, lots of time, relatively steep learning curve, needs to be professional quality, and you need to actually have the rights to a real song) means that it's primary purpose is to increase the amount of DLC available and the ease with which bands can get into Rock Band.



    You can't really steal someone else's music to chart it in RBN. I mean, you might technically be able to, but even aside from the legality issues, you'd only be able to to play it in audition mode, wouldn't be able to submit it,
    LMAO, I can't help but put what you just said this way:

    Neversoft made a poor man's music creator while Harmonix made a rich man's music creator.

    That high barrier you mentioned about RBN is a real turn off...mainly the cash part...but then again, I'm unemployed at the moment so...maybe thats why I say this. I'd gladly take the time to learn how to use everything, but I really don't wanna have to put up all that cash to release a song on RBN that might not do well. Then again, I'm a pessimist, so what do I know? :/

    However, the fact it allows real songs is a great upside. :)
  • afterstasisafterstasis Washed Up
    edited September 2009
    Lunar_Savage;2994640 said:

    I'd gladly take the time to learn how to use everything, but I really don't wanna have to put up all that cash to release a song on RBN that might not do well.
    you don't have to do either, though...
    there are quite a few groups taking submissions who will do the RBN work for musicians who want to have their music released, basically eliminating the membership fee and charting process in exchange for a percentage of the profits.
  • Lunar_SavageLunar_Savage Unsigned
    edited September 2009
    afterstasis;2994762 said:
    you don't have to do either, though...
    there are quite a few groups taking submissions who will do the RBN work for musicians who want to have their music released, basically eliminating the membership fee and charting process in exchange for a percentage of the profits.
    Cool. Then I guess its not so bad then.
  • eddiehead-666eddiehead-666 Unsigned
    edited September 2009
    Me and a friend were talking about this about 2 days before it was announced - saying "wouldn't it be great if Harmonix could just release the software they use to chart the songs to us - that way we could get our own songs and chart it"

    The main reason for this though appears to not be what I originally wanted. I'd like harmonix to release the software to anyone (maybe a fee through XBL/PSN) so that we can put any song we want on there.

    There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.

    Of course, if bands want to release songs and make money from DCL etc they can still pay the subscription allowing them to upload - but I'm not bothered about that. I want this music creator so that I can put my favourite songs onto my console for my own enjoyment.

    Reckon Harmonix might consider doing that?
  • LuigiHannLuigiHann Stormtrooper
    edited September 2009
    eddiehead-666;3001754 said:
    There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.
    It doesn't work that way, at all. The best they could possibly do with auto-charting along with an mp3 would end up synchronizing with the music about as well as audiosurf does. It's conceivable that someday they'd have software that could chart based on the pitch of the sounds, but even that would require a split master track to isolate the individual instruments (not for the usual reasons, but because the software would need to "hear" them separately to auto-chart them).

    So even if they did release the tools to everybody for free, you'd still have to spend hours and hours charting the song manually.
  • eddiehead-666eddiehead-666 Unsigned
    edited September 2009
    LuigiHann;3002589 said:
    It doesn't work that way, at all. The best they could possibly do with auto-charting along with an mp3 would end up synchronizing with the music about as well as audiosurf does. It's conceivable that someday they'd have software that could chart based on the pitch of the sounds, but even that would require a split master track to isolate the individual instruments (not for the usual reasons, but because the software would need to "hear" them separately to auto-chart them).

    So even if they did release the tools to everybody for free, you'd still have to spend hours and hours charting the song manually.
    and I deffo should have included that I only use the drums - so the pitch wouldn't make a difference to me.
    I'm pretty sure Harmonix has the ability to split tracks down to seperate sounds. I've been using similar software in music enginnering for a while now, the software is out there and most of it does run automatically
    I read somewhere also that the software harmonix is planning to release does have some automatic features, such as speed adjustments, notes per beat calculations and will fill in some of the more basic structures for all instruments. Even if it matches the amount of notes you need to play all that will then require is for you to go in and move the already charted buttons to a different button (so if it sees 50 green notes one after the other in a solo, you can then go in and move any of the notes around to a different button to make it represent scales and the pitch changing of the song as you said)

    BTW there was also a similar piece of software to this released with dance dance revolution on the PC about 3 years ago - it mapped almost all of the notes that it heard in a song, you just went in and played with what it gave you. Fair enough you'll say it's not the same as having a guitar controller "authentically" match pitch changes, but the possibilities are there

    oh and also personally most of the fun of creating a track would be to actually chart it out manually. more sense of achievement knowing you're jamming along to something that you - in part - created and it's the music you love. To me that would near enough mean having to learn how to play the song as if I were on a real kit
  • afterstasisafterstasis Washed Up
    edited September 2009
    eddiehead-666;3002628 said:

    I'm pretty sure Harmonix has the ability to split tracks down to seperate sounds. I've been using similar software in music enginnering for a while now, the software is out there and most of it does run automatically
    please share this software with the rest of the world! :)

    melodyne's direct note access is still the closest i've heard of this, and it still hasn't been released (possible vaporware at this point, really) and will doubtfully be as automatic many expect.
  • Punk_Floyd76Punk_Floyd76 Unsigned
    edited September 2009
    eddiehead-666;3001754 said:
    Me and a friend were talking about this about 2 days before it was announced - saying "wouldn't it be great if Harmonix could just release the software they use to chart the songs to us - that way we could get our own songs and chart it"

    The main reason for this though appears to not be what I originally wanted. I'd like harmonix to release the software to anyone (maybe a fee through XBL/PSN) so that we can put any song we want on there.

    There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.

    Of course, if bands want to release songs and make money from DCL etc they can still pay the subscription allowing them to upload - but I'm not bothered about that. I want this music creator so that I can put my favourite songs onto my console for my own enjoyment.

    Reckon Harmonix might consider doing that?
    Do I reckon harmonix would consider eliminating any and all future DLC and possibly disc revenue(plus legal fees from the countless lawsuits they'd receive) so you can play your favorite songs? No I don't reckon.
  • edited September 2009
    Not really. This you have to write the songs yourself on real instruments and pay money and earn money from your songs. The Gh4(which was terrible) and the Gh5(which is way better than the gh4 one) music creators let you use the guitar hero instruments and it was free. I will probably never use the RBN for my songs but I have already used the gh5 one.
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