RBN + Rhythm Guitar

striderblackstriderblack Road Warrior
edited September 2009 in The Rock Band Network
Theoretical question, maybe someone involved in independent authoring can answer me...

Say Band X asks Independent Authoring Company Y to make some Rock Band Network tracks for them...but Band X requests that they chart the "Bass" guitar section as actually the Rhythm Guitar in the song. So there's no bass to be played, only whoever picks Guitar gets Lead Guitar, and whoever picks Bass gets Rhythm Guitar.

Would this be acceptable to request?

Would it make it past testing?

Any thoughts?

Comments

  • trg007trg007 Your Ever Rocking RBN Forum Guru
    edited September 2009
    Not sure if there's an official policy on what you're required to chart, but this post by HMXEnosity implies that you have to chart all of the instruments that fall under the "main four" (G/B/D/V) if they are in the actual song.

    I would imagine that if a song had no bass, just lead and rhythm, that you could chart rhythm to the bass chart. If there is an actual bass guitar being played in the song, however, you'd probably be obligated to chart the bass.
  • SynesterSeXSynesterSeX Rising Star
    edited September 2009
    Well i dont think they should remove the bass. Instead, i recommend they add an additional instrument into Rock Band.

    So instead of removing bass, you get the option of either picking bass or rhythm(if any)
  • striderblackstriderblack Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    SynesterSeX;3058203 said:
    Well i dont think they should remove the bass. Instead, i recommend they add an additional instrument into Rock Band.

    So instead of removing bass, you get the option of either picking bass or rhythm(if any)
    Can't do that without reworking the entire framework of the game. It's definitely the best option, and hopefully one we can see in RB3.

    I just figured if the band is taking the time to record their stuff for Rock Band, they should be entitled to put in whatever charts they please for their instruments as long as they fit in the framework. TRG is probably right, though.
  • trg007trg007 Your Ever Rocking RBN Forum Guru
    edited September 2009
    Another thing to consider is the Bass Groove, the 6x multiplier, and the different list of effects that are available when playing bass. Those are probably hard-coded in the game, not something you could turn off if you were charting a 2nd guitar. It obviously wouldn't make sense to be playing the rhythm guitar and see "Bass Groove" pop up on your screen.
  • davidshekdavidshek Community Playtester
    edited September 2009
    trg007;3058122 said:
    Not sure if there's an official policy on what you're required to chart, but this post by HMXEnosity implies that you have to chart all of the instruments that fall under the "main four" (G/B/D/V) if they are in the actual song.
    This post is correct. If there's bass in the song, a bass track gets authored. If there is no bass in the song, a bass track does not get authored. You can't use the bass track as a "catch all" for other instruments.
  • DavyinaTogaDavyinaToga Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    davidshek;3058349 said:
    This post is correct. If there's bass in the song, a bass track gets authored. If there is no bass in the song, a bass track does not get authored. You can't use the bass track as a "catch all" for other instruments.
    I just want to point out two facts that make me waver just a little in accepting that answer, DavidShek:

    1) Look at songs like Lump, where there is no real 'bass' per se. Both players in PUSA play guitar chords and bass notes, so no there is no real 'bass' part that was charted in the game to correlate with the 'bass notes'. There are a couple sections with bass lines in Lump, which it was then charted to Bass, but overall it acts as a rhythm guitar part for that song.

    Now, this point is moot if the song OP is asking about indeed does have a bass. However, I'm sure it could be worked around to apply some (in not all) the rhythm guitar part to the bass part, regardless.

    2) Hello, are we all forgetting about split tracking that's so common in GH/RB? When the lead isn't playing, rhythm can be set to the guitar part, too. If OP's band doesn't recognize that, then it should be good enough. If they do and still want a rhythm guitar part, then again, they can add some rhythm guitar to the bass part.


    Maybe it's just a question that would need to be addressed case-by-case. I don't think there's really a catch-all answer.

    Of course, I hope we all agree that the 'bass' part, whether it's charted to the bass or rhythm guitar, is still gonna be called "Bass" in the game. That's plainly obvious.
  • LuigiHannLuigiHann Stormtrooper
    edited September 2009
    davidshek;3058349 said:
    This post is correct. If there's bass in the song, a bass track gets authored. If there is no bass in the song, a bass track does not get authored. You can't use the bass track as a "catch all" for other instruments.
    But you CAN use the guitar track for that? As Rock Band has often done? :|

    I think that, for instance, if a song has "dueling guitar solos," those parts should be charted to Guitar and Bass to create a fun back-and-forth feeling... and if in the OP's situation, the song has that kind of interplay between the lead and the rhythm guitar, it would be a much more authentic experience to have the two parts played as Guitar and Bass, rather than having the guitarist swap back and forth.
  • davidshekdavidshek Community Playtester
    edited September 2009
    LuigiHann;3058520 said:
    But you CAN use the guitar track for that? As Rock Band has often done? :|
    I disagree with your use of the word "often". Give examples.

    So here's the deal...you can author things however you want to. If you want to put rhythm guitar on the "Bass" track, you can. The question is not whether you can or not. The real question is whether the hundreds (or thousands) of peer reviewers will give your song an "Approved" score if you do it.
  • Death50Death50 Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    Hopefully with RB3 (please let it be soon) there will be some serious gameplay changes.
  • LuigiHannLuigiHann Stormtrooper
    edited September 2009
    davidshek;3058963 said:
    I disagree with your use of the word "often". Give examples.
    I didn't mean, like, "frequently," I just mean it has happened more than a handful of times.
  • voodoo618voodoo618 Headliner
    edited September 2009
    davidshek;3058963 said:
    I disagree with your use of the word "often". Give examples.

    So here's the deal...you can author things however you want to. If you want to put rhythm guitar on the "Bass" track, you can. The question is not whether you can or not. The real question is whether the hundreds (or thousands) of peer reviewers will give your song an "Approved" score if you do it.
    As a reviewer, I would only give the song a "thumbs up" if there is no bass. If there is bass and I'm still playing rhythm guitar from the bass option, I won't approve it.
  • wesjett08wesjett08 Rising Star
    edited September 2009
    The Yeah Yeah Yeah's songs also have the 2nd guitar charted to bass.It DOES happend...Just not often.
  • SirRobin1tothe3SirRobin1tothe3 Opening Act
    edited September 2009
    As long as there ISN'T bass in the song, charting something else to bass would probably only get voted down by people who think Rock Band is supposed to be realistic.
  • HauntingYourKidsHauntingYourKids Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    Jeez, why do all these babies want their rhythm guitars? All they do is maintain the riff while the lead guy does his thing. Can anyone name a song where the rhythm guitar gets awesome while the lead guitarist is performing a solo? Of course you can't! He's to busy keeping a riff you probably heard in the bridge or chorus audible! You're probably to distracted by the possibility of playing those precious chords to notice! That's all it's really about, chords.
  • davidshekdavidshek Community Playtester
    edited September 2009
    HauntingYourKids;3063026 said:
    All they do is maintain the riff while the lead guy does his thing. Can anyone name a song where the rhythm guitar gets awesome while the lead guitarist is performing a solo? Of course you can't! He's to busy keeping a riff you probably heard in the bridge or chorus audible! You're probably to distracted by the possibility of playing those precious chords to notice! That's all it's really about, chords.
    Yeah, that's not even close to all of what rhythm guitarists do, but that was a nice try. :)
  • PCTraitorPCTraitor Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    I want to make the guitar charts more boring by splitting the one track between rhythm and lead
  • PCTraitorPCTraitor Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    HauntingYourKids;3063026 said:
    Jeez, why do all these babies want their rhythm guitars? All they do is maintain the riff while the lead guy does his thing. Can anyone name a song where the rhythm guitar gets awesome while the lead guitarist is performing a solo? Of course you can't! He's to busy keeping a riff you probably heard in the bridge or chorus audible! You're probably to distracted by the possibility of playing those precious chords to notice! That's all it's really about, chords.
    For most bands you're right. In fact many bands like Weezer are mostly just playing the same thing until their is a solo or a lead. There aren't many dual lead bands even if so many posters in this forum want you to believe otherwise.
  • HyeJinx1984HyeJinx1984 Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    I don't think it would be a problem since back when HMX was making Guitar Hero games often times the "bass" would be a rhythm guitar because that was what was available or in some cases simply more fun than the bass on that particular track.

    I always saw the "bass" option in these games to mean "rhythm string instrument" whether that's Bass (99% of the time) or Rhythm guitar (occasionally).
  • LuigiHannLuigiHann Stormtrooper
    edited September 2009
    I know, I know what to do, OP. Tell them you can chart it that way, but only if you alter the rhythm guitar audio track to sound like bass
  • davidshekdavidshek Community Playtester
    edited September 2009
    HyeJinx1984;3063538 said:
    I don't think it would be a problem since back when HMX was making Guitar Hero games often times the "bass" would be a rhythm guitar because that was what was available or in some cases simply more fun than the bass on that particular track.
    That's not really relevant here. Back in those days, the game actually specified Rhythm or Bass when you went to choose the 2nd guitar's part. RB does not.

    That was also before the Bass Groove.
  • wesjett08wesjett08 Rising Star
    edited September 2009
    LuigiHann;3063939 said:
    I know, I know what to do, OP. Tell them you can chart it that way, but only if you alter the rhythm guitar audio track to sound like bass
    *Ding ding* We have a winner...

    This seems to work for the Yeah Yeah Yeah's and the White Stripes...
  • UltraceUltrace Road Warrior
    edited September 2009
    voodoo618;3059369 said:
    As a reviewer, I would only give the song a "thumbs up" if there is no bass. If there is bass and I'm still playing rhythm guitar from the bass option, I won't approve it.
    Likewise, I wouldn't be putting approval on anything where an instrument other than bass is charted as bass, even if the bass is repetitive and boring (one only has to look at So Whatcha Want to see HMX's stance on charting bass, even when it's horribly boring.)

    Now, songs where a guitar (or keyboard--i.e., Freezepop) was actually played as a bass are a different matter entirely, but if someone wants to put rhythm guitar, keyboard, trumpet, kazoo, whatever on bass and ignore the bass, that's a no-go.
Sign In or Register to comment.