Chords, HOPO's, and Combo rules

GeneralGilliamGeneralGilliam Opening Act
edited December 2009 in The Rock Band Network
Hey, I was just wondering what exactly are the rules when it comes to Chords, HOPO's and combos? I have ade a list of every popssible combination I could think of, if someone FROM HARMONIX would go through and put a Y (yes as in it is allowed) or a N (o as in it is not allowed) next to each of these this would be greatly appreciated.
G=Green
R=Red
Y=Yellow
B=Blue
O=Orange

CHORDS:
~G,R,Y,B
~G,Y,B,O
~G,R,Y,O
~R,Y,B,O
~Those 4, but with HOPO'S
~G,R,Y,B,O
~G,R,Y,B,O with HOPO
~G,R,O
~G,B,O
~G,Y,O
~3 note chords with HOPO's
~the previous 3 3 note chords with HOPO's
~2 single note HOPO's of the same color in a row
~ 2 2 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
~ 2 3 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
~ 2 4 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
~ 2 5 note chord HOPO's in a row
~ Notes inside of hold notes, like in GH:WT and onward


All of these appear to work fine in REAPER, even the GH stly notes in notes, but I am wondering if these will
1. work in-game
2. be allowed to pass "inspection"?

~Tim

Comments

  • trg007trg007 Your Ever Rocking RBN Forum Guru
    edited December 2009
    Read the following, which is FROM HARMONIX: http://creators.rockband.com/spec/Guitar_and_Bass_Authoring
    GeneralGilliam;3346838 said:
    CHORDS:
    ~G,R,Y,B
    ~G,Y,B,O
    ~G,R,Y,O
    ~R,Y,B,O
    ~Those 4, but with HOPO'S
    ~G,R,Y,B,O
    ~G,R,Y,B,O with HOPO
    ~G,R,O
    ~G,B,O
    ~G,Y,O
    ~3 note chords with HOPO's
    ~the previous 3 3 note chords with HOPO's
    ~ 2 4 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
    ~ 2 5 note chord HOPO's in a row
    ~ Notes inside of hold notes, like in GH:WT and onward
    All of these = NO. 3-note chords cannot contain both the G and O fret in the same chord. 4- and 5-note chords are just a no-no, period. Just because you can place those notes doesn't mean that Magma won't fail your build and require you to change them, not to mention reviewers will fail anything that violates authoring standards (even if Magma allows it).

    I know that Magma won't allow the GH-style sustains with other notes played while the sustain is held. Any time you have two notes that overlap each other, both notes have to start and end in the same place. It'll give you a "misaligned chord" error, or something to that effect.
    ~2 single note HOPO's of the same color in a row
    ~ 2 2 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
    ~ 2 3 note chord HOPO's of the same color in a row
    I have seen the first two in a couple of HMX songs (specifically, the consecutive chord HOPOs in Bodhisattva) but these would probably be failed by reviewers unless you have a really specific reason for doing it.
  • GeneralGilliamGeneralGilliam Opening Act
    edited December 2009
    alright thanks, I had a couple of those no-no's in my songs like in a part of a bas song you can hear the bassist smacking his hand against the body of the guitar really obviously in a pattern for about 10 seconds so I charted those as 4 note chords (just seemed to work) and there is a part f another song where the lead guitar cuts out and a keyboard solo is played, I charted that for lead guitar as all HOPO's ans it just seems to "flow" and feel correct.
  • animemetalheadanimemetalhead Road Warrior
    edited December 2009
    GeneralGilliam;3346925 said:
    alright thanks, I had a couple of those no-no's in my songs like in a part of a bas song you can hear the bassist smacking his hand against the body of the guitar really obviously in a pattern for about 10 seconds so I charted those as 4 note chords (just seemed to work) and there is a part f another song where the lead guitar cuts out and a keyboard solo is played, I charted that for lead guitar as all HOPO's ans it just seems to "flow" and feel correct.
    Wait, if I'm reading this right, you charted a keyboard solo as lead guitar?

    DO NOT GO ACTIVISION ON US!! Keep keyboard in the background and don't make the guitarist play anything non-guitar.
  • MagnetMagnet Moderator
    edited December 2009
    animemetalhead;3347040 said:
    Wait, if I'm reading this right, you charted a keyboard solo as lead guitar?

    DO NOT GO ACTIVISION ON US!! Keep keyboard in the background and don't make the guitarist play anything non-guitar.
    Harmonix has authored non-guitar parts to guitar plenty of times before. Apparently it is encouraged as long as it is tasteful. Sorry that you don't personally like it, but there are those who do. These case-by-case authoring decisions are ultimately up to the author as long as it passes peer review.
  • DavyinaTogaDavyinaToga Road Warrior
    edited December 2009
    trg007;3346876 said:
    I have seen the first two in a couple of HMX songs (specifically, the consecutive chord HOPOs in Bodhisattva) but these would probably be failed by reviewers unless you have a really specific reason for doing it.
    Just because HMX did it, doesn't mean it's kosher. They've amended their standards after RB2's release (and even some DLC), so for the most part always ask. I'll try to find the post from HMX_Mister_Game mentioning a GYO chord in one of their songs.
  • CCDaDonCCDaDon Headliner
    edited December 2009
    GeneralGilliam;3346925 said:
    alright thanks, I had a couple of those no-no's in my songs like in a part of a bas song you can hear the bassist smacking his hand against the body of the guitar really obviously in a pattern for about 10 seconds so I charted those as 4 note chords (just seemed to work) and there is a part f another song where the lead guitar cuts out and a keyboard solo is played, I charted that for lead guitar as all HOPO's ans it just seems to "flow" and feel correct.
    I'm sorry but from the looks of things, you kinda need to relearn how to chart. None of the things you've said you're doing makes sense gameplay wise.

    Chords have to do with the the fret hand and how it is being used. If the strum hand hits the body and none of the strings it shouldn't be charted. At all. See: Polly's Guitar Chart. If he slaps it and hits a string it should be charted as a single note, since he plays one note while hitting the body with his strum hand.
  • NSIYusukeNSIYusuke Opening Act
    edited December 2009
    Would single-note hammerons work in a row? I have a few songs with killswitching, and I like the idea of being able to chart those segments as Ho/Po chains, even if there are two of the same note right after eachother.
  • animemetalheadanimemetalhead Road Warrior
    edited December 2009
    Magnet;3347091 said:
    Harmonix has authored non-guitar parts to guitar plenty of times before. Apparently it is encouraged as long as it is tasteful. Sorry that you don't personally like it, but there are those who do. These case-by-case authoring decisions are ultimately up to the author as long as it passes peer review.
    DavyinaToga;3348640 said:
    Just because HMX did it, doesn't mean it's kosher. They've amended their standards after RB2's release (and even some DLC), so for the most part always ask. I'll try to find the post from HMX_Mister_Game mentioning a GYO chord in one of their songs.
    Look, after playing various Guitar Heroes, I (and many others) have always complained about being forced to play non-guitar parts when we're on guitar. They didn't make us play keyboard during the break in Won't Get Fooled Again, and they definitely didn't make us play the keyboard solo in Panic Attack. The authoring instructions say that Expert charts should be as close to a note-for note transcription of the GUITAR as possible.

    Just because someone THINKS keyboard should be included as a playable instrument doesn't make it right to shove it on the guitarist. Until Harmonix adds keyboards as an instrument, I say keep that crap in the backing track.
  • QuazifujiQuazifuji Opening Act
    edited December 2009
    NSIYusuke;3350182 said:
    Would single-note hammerons work in a row? I have a few songs with killswitching, and I like the idea of being able to chart those segments as Ho/Po chains, even if there are two of the same note right after eachother.
    I'm pretty sure they work. I don't remember where, but I think there may be instances of them in the game. They'd probably work the same as the Boddhisattva chords (you can hit them by lifting your fingers and pressing the buttons again without strumming).
    animemetalhead;3350187 said:
    Look, after playing various Guitar Heroes, I (and many others) have always complained about being forced to play non-guitar parts when we're on guitar. They didn't make us play keyboard during the break in Won't Get Fooled Again, and they definitely didn't make us play the keyboard solo in Panic Attack. The authoring instructions say that Expert charts should be as close to a note-for note transcription of the GUITAR as possible.

    Just because someone THINKS keyboard should be included as a playable instrument doesn't make it right to shove it on the guitarist. Until Harmonix adds keyboards as an instrument, I say keep that crap in the backing track.
    On the other hand, I think the organ solos are the best part of the Smokin' guitar chart, and there are some songs where the guitar would have a huge blank space or no part at all if it weren't charted to another instrument (such as the outro of Prostitute or Saucy Jack). Maybe you'd rather sit there doing nothing in those situations, but that's certainly not the case for everyone.

    My personal opinion is that if there is a guitar playing, then that's what should be charted, even if a different instrument has what might be a more interesting part (e.g. if there's a keyboard solo going on with a rhythm guitar part in the background, the guitar should be charted, not the keyboard solo), but if there's no guitar then it's more fun to play a different instrument then have a lot of blank space (so if there is no guitar in the background, go ahead and chart the keyboard solo).

    But in the end, lot of it's just a matter of opinion/preference, and the best way to go about it might just be do what you want to do, and see what happens in playtest. If you chart the keyboard in a place and just about everyone playing the songs says you shouldn't, then you should probably cut it out. If lots of people compliment you on how fun the keyboard section is, then leave it in. I believe the official statement from Harmonix is that charting non-guitar parts is okay as long as it's done tastefully.
  • trg007trg007 Your Ever Rocking RBN Forum Guru
    edited December 2009
    Quazifuji;3350205 said:
    I believe the official statement from Harmonix is that charting non-guitar parts is okay as long as it's done tastefully.
    This is correct. If you're going to be a part of the RBN, get used to the idea of different instruments being charted. :)
  • GeneralGilliamGeneralGilliam Opening Act
    edited December 2009
    Well all the keyboard part I charted is just a 13 second solo with no distortion guitar in the background, not some elaborate minute and a half piano solo.....*cough*activision*cough*...*cough*scatterbrain*cough*

    ALSO, to avoid people criticising my keyboard chartiness, all parts in my songs that sound like a keyboard are now guitar with an awesome effects pedal.....as far as you know ;D
  • animemetalheadanimemetalhead Road Warrior
    edited December 2009
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