The charting groups should be a little more aware of different genres.

ShibariShibari Opening Act
edited September 2010 in The Rock Band Network
For example they put Attack Attack! (Which should be labeled as emo, obviously) into metal category, as well as Asking Alexandria. Post-hardcore is not metal!!!

Also, the smaller things, like Suicide Silence is not death metal, it's deathcore, Terrorhorse is not thrash metal, it's death metal, some -core bands are labeled as something else etc.

This would not be so annoying for others but for example I get hugely annoyed when somebody calls bands like BFMV thrash metal. I would like the charting groups to do a little more research on genres before they put the songs to RBN.

Comments

  • TheDillingerEPTheDillingerEP Unsigned
    edited September 2010
    For one, why does it really matter?
    And for two, Attack Attack! is definitely not emo.
  • afterstasisafterstasis Washed Up
    edited September 2010
    funny that someone's complaining about this and then calls AA emo. :)
  • Nathaniel607Nathaniel607 Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    Genres will never be right. I, for one, don't consider the -core thing an actual genre. It's like "Death metal with some breakdowns and punky bits that sometimes sing". Just deathcore to me. And to me, Between the Burried and Me are Progressive Metal. Definitely.
  • kingtonyxkingtonyx Unofficial
    edited September 2010
    Attack Attack! is not even modern emo

    they, like Asking Alexandria, are metalcore
  • ShibariShibari Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    Well yeah Attack Attack are not tr00 metalz because they use autotune vocals and techno parts so I can't let them be in my metal!!!! Also death metal and deathcore are VERY different.

    Well I think it after all is a little stupid, but I cry a little everytime i see AA in the middle of the metal bands.

    And I can label AA emo just because all the band members look like emos. I know I can.
  • T-HybridT-Hybrid Washed Up
    edited September 2010
    Shibari;3992518 said:
    Well yeah Attack Attack are not tr00 metalz because they use autotune vocals and techno parts so I can't let them be in my metal!!!! Also death metal and deathcore are VERY different.

    Well I think it after all is a little stupid, but I cry a little everytime i see AA in the middle of the metal bands.

    And I can label AA emo just because all the band members look like emos. I know I can.
    I can't tell if this post is a joke or not, but given the OP...I sadly doubt it.
  • Nathaniel607Nathaniel607 Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    Shibari;3992518 said:
    Well yeah Attack Attack are not tr00 metalz because they use autotune vocals and techno parts so I can't let them be in my metal!!!! Also death metal and deathcore are VERY different.

    Well I think it after all is a little stupid, but I cry a little everytime i see AA in the middle of the metal bands.

    And I can label AA emo just because all the band members look like emos. I know I can.
    1) They sound (from that description) like metal with techno parts.

    2) A BAND IS NOT LABELED DEPENDING ON HOW IT LOOKS! IT'S A MUSIC GENRE, NOT A STYLISTIC GENRE.

    Also, deathcore and death metal aren't very different. I had an argument about this before and the only thing I found out was that deathcore is "punk inspired" which means precisely jack ****.
  • aggiesrul8aggiesrul8 Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    Shibari;3992518 said:
    And I can label AA emo just because all the band members look like emos. I know I can.
    Last AA meeting I attended, nobody looked like this mythical 'emo'??

    :rolleyes:
  • moomandwwmoomandww Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    Deathcore is a combination of hardcore punk and death metal. Its a fusion genre rather than an actual death metal sub-genre.

    But on topic, some genre placement can be very subjective depending on the band or labels feelings toward it. In the case of AA, its Metalcore with techno influences for the end break down, so putting it in Metal/Alternative was actually the perfect genre classification in this case.

    (BTW, its actually scene style that they all look like, witch is essentially emo without the crying and hating life)
  • TheDillingerEPTheDillingerEP Unsigned
    edited September 2010
    Shibari;3992518 said:
    Well yeah Attack Attack are not tr00 metalz because they use autotune vocals and techno parts so I can't let them be in my metal!!!! Also death metal and deathcore are VERY different.

    Well I think it after all is a little stupid, but I cry a little everytime i see AA in the middle of the metal bands.

    And I can label AA emo just because all the band members look like emos. I know I can.

    I'd hate to see what you label other bands just depending on their looks. And if you want to get really specific Attack Attack! is actually crabcore.
  • MooTrainMooTrain Rising Star
    edited September 2010
    The true genre for attack attack is CRABcore. Unfortunately, as that is not an accepted genre for submissions, they had to be shoehorned into something else.
  • jeccanekojeccaneko Headliner
    edited September 2010
    Genres are so subjective. Personally, I don't pay attention to genres. There's plenty of songs I don't agree with the genres, and most of those are official HMX songs.

    The only reason genre matters in Rock Band is for sorting by genres and, like I said, those are subjective so you probably won't always agree. So even sorting by genre isn't that useful, IMO.
  • kiggidykevkiggidykev Thinks about pandas
    edited September 2010
    Look on the bright side: once RB3 comes out, we can all make our own subjective lists anyway separated by whatever genre we consider songs to be.
  • NoThru22NoThru22 Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    This reminds me of my friend who said that country and rap shouldn't be in Rock Band because they're not Rock. He says that Rock means hardcore and that the game should be called Rock and Roll Band instead.
  • ThatAuthoringGroupThatAuthoringGroup Numero Uno Super **** Fanboy #1
    edited September 2010
    We're going to list all our songs under the whocarescore genre :p
  • thjimmythjimmy Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    It makes a difference to me. I don't have (or spend) the time to listen to every song that RBN produces. I make my selections easier by listening to certain genres, taking in posters opinions, and looking at No Thru22's "Semi-Official Drum Solo Thread." Check it out if you like drum solos.
  • taylorleetaylorlee Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    Nathaniel607;3992663 said:
    1)

    2) A BAND IS NOT LABELED DEPENDING ON HOW IT LOOKS! IT'S A MUSIC GENRE, NOT A STYLISTIC GENRE.

    Isn't that what "Glam" is?
  • Metal_Freak219Metal_Freak219 Rising Star
    edited September 2010
    afterstasis;3992403 said:
    funny that someone's complaining about this and then calls AA emo. :)
    Well, they're barely Metal in my opinion.
  • wrldindstries302wrldindstries302 Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    I thought this was going to be a topic about how the charting groups should try to get artists from a wider variety of genres.

    Instead I come in and see it's just a metal classification topic. :rolleyes:
  • T-HybridT-Hybrid Washed Up
    edited September 2010
    Metal_Freak219;3992831 said:
    Well, they're barely Metal in my opinion.
    Oh man, what the heck were they thinking releasing this song without first gaining your approval for the genre?
    wrldindstries302;3992960 said:
    Instead I come in and see it's just a metal classification topic.
    It does seem like anytime there's a thread whining about genres it's yet another metalhead uptight that such and such was/wasn't categorized as metal. Or that HMX hasn't released any "true metal" since whatever band they liked.
    TheDillingerEP;3992702 said:
    I'd hate to see what you label other bands just depending on their looks.
    I want to start a band called "Southern Comfort" where we dress in all cowboy gear, have songs like "Old Town Woman", "Tumbleweed Circus", and "Barfly"...but then play the most hardcore deathmetal you've ever heard.

    Just to piss off the OP when he sees us categorized as "Metal" in the RBN.
  • EaglesBecomeVulturesEaglesBecomeVultures Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    kingtonyx;3992439 said:
    Attack Attack! is not even modern emo

    they, like Asking Alexandria, are metalcore
    Yup, and in AA's case: metalcore by numbers.
  • PowerGamer990PowerGamer990 Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    EaglesBecomeVultures;3993044 said:
    Yup, and in AA's case: metalcore by numbers.
    This is why people shouldn't abbreviate EVERY band name. You just mentioned Attack Attack! and Asking Alexandria, then referred to "AA." Which is which?

    Sorry, I just had to share my lol moment with you. :D
  • aggiesrul8aggiesrul8 Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    I'll put this in the Nuclear Reactor Core genre, because diz stuffz willz meltz ya fazzzeeee
  • SequenceFSequenceF Opening Act
    edited September 2010
  • ThunderCurlsThunderCurls Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    xXPM5KXx;3992279 said:
    Dude, genres are completely subjective. .
    Genres are not subjective. If I were to call Metallica 'Trance' and Paramore 'Death Metal' I would be totally wrong, and thus the subjectivity goes ot the window. ;)

    Just because a band thinks or says they are a certain genre doesn't mean they actually are, it all comes down to their basic sound/style. For example Trivium and Suicide Silence both claim to be/play a certain genre of music but when you actually listen to it their description couldn't be further from the truth.

    Suicide Silence are Deathcore not Death Metal and Trivium are certainly not Thrash Metal as they have claimed before, they're straight up Metalcore.

    It's all very simple.
  • exploderexploder Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    HelloMaster;3992290 said:
    As I understand it, most of the genre selections in RBN are self-identified by the band, or at least the label. That's why the emo genre will always be sparse. There are many more bands that critics and casual listeners would classify as emo than would actually self-identify as emo, because it's such a maligned term these days.

    You gotta let'em play a little loose with it, too. One of my faves, Between the Buried and Me, described their fifth album as "New Wave Polka Grunge". Not exactly an option.

    But most importantly, as long as you like the music, what do you care what the genre is? Are you afraid if you accidentally listen to some emo the school bully will steal your lunch money?

    this.
    I always tell punk elitists that I can listen to sum 41 and other pop-punk bands if I want to.
  • Nathaniel607Nathaniel607 Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    ThunderCurls;3993636 said:
    Genres are not subjective. If I were to call Metallica 'Trance' and Paramore 'Death Metal' I would be totally wrong, and thus the subjectivity goes ot the window. ;)

    Just because a band thinks or says they are a certain genre doesn't mean they actually are, it all comes down to their basic sound/style. For example Trivium and Suicide Silence both claim to be/play a certain genre of music but when you actually listen to it their description couldn't be further from the truth.

    Suicide Silence are Deathcore not Death Metal and Trivium are certainly not Thrash Metal as they have claimed before, they're straight up Metalcore.

    It's all very simple. Sure you might think otherwise, but that's just your opinion...which doesn't automatically make it right.
    No, but genres definitely aren't completely objective. They have a large amount of subjectivity... especially when you start bringing in made-up genres (or sub-sub genres) like saurekraut-core, emo, britpop etc.
  • ThunderCurlsThunderCurls Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    Nathaniel607;3993664 said:
    They have a large amount of subjectivity....
    They have no subjectivity, if you sound like the genre and look like the genre then chances are you are that genre.

    I'm sure nobody expects people to take those made-up genres seriously. Between The Buried And Me for example, describing their fifth album as "New Wave Polka Grunge".
  • QuazifujiQuazifuji Opening Act
    edited September 2010
    ThunderCurls;3993801 said:
    They have no subjectivity, if you sound like the genre and look like the genre then chances are you are that genre.

    I'm sure nobody expects people to take those made-up genres seriously. Between The Buried And Me for example, describing their fifth album as "New Wave Polka Grunge".
    There's lots of subjectivity in the "sound like the genre" part. Yeah, some bands clearly fall into a certain genre, either because they perfectly match the archetypal sound of that genre, or because they're one of the bands that essentially defines the genre. If you try to claim that The Who isn't classic rock or Judas Priest isn't metal, then no one's going to listen to you. There are also some genres that have more objective definitions (I don't think I've ever seen anyone debate whether a certain band is NWOBHM or not).

    I'll even agree that some songs in RBN seem clear-cut. Asking Alexandria, for example, does seem to fit the metalcore template pretty much perfectly (mix of hardcore screaming and clean vocals, slower breakdowns combined with death or thrash-y riffs), and it does seem like if the genre's there it's where they belong (how much this actually matters is a different story).

    But let's look at Between the Buried and Me, since you brought them up. New Wave Polka Grunge certainly seems a bit silly, but what should they objectively be called. Metalcore? They've got a lot of metalcore-style vocals and breakdowns, but they've also got proggier elements that aren't there in typical metalcore. Of course, if we call them prog, we've got the opposite problem, where it addresses the non-standard song structures and changing time signatures and such, but putting them in the same genre as Rush and Kansas seems kind of weird. Prog Metal seems sort of like a compromise, but you can nitpick that too. And meanwhile, some of their songs do suddenly break into weird polka or country-sounding bits or other strangeness. Does that have to be addressed in the genre?

    Overall, the whole matter can be pretty ambiguous. You can say that if two bands sound alike they should be the same genre, but it's subjective and depends on what you focus on. Lots of bands combine elements of different genres and you can easily debate where the line between genres is (when does a song stop being death metal and become deathcore? Are the two even different enough to be different genres?). And, finally, even if bands often identify themselves as weird genres that listeners might disagree with, it's probably in the authors' best interest to listen to the band or label anyway. This may mean some bands classify themselves oddly, or avoid genres that they may perceive as having some sort of stigma against them (like emo or metalcore), but in the end, it's not that big a deal.
  • ThunderCurlsThunderCurls Road Warrior
    edited September 2010
    Quazifuji;3994032 said:
    But let's look at Between the Buried and Me, since you brought them up. New Wave Polka Grunge certainly seems a bit silly, but what should they objectively be called. Metalcore? They've got a lot of metalcore-style vocals and breakdowns, but they've also got proggier elements that aren't there in typical metalcore. Of course, if we call them prog, we've got the opposite problem, where it addresses the non-standard song structures and changing time signatures and such, but putting them in the same genre as Rush and Kansas seems kind of weird. Prog Metal seems sort of like a compromise, but you can nitpick that too. And meanwhile, some of their songs do suddenly break into weird polka or country-sounding bits or other strangeness. Does that have to be addressed in the genre?
    Mathcore.
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