What Happened to Flame Notes In Rockband Blitz?????

cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
edited September 2013 in Rock Band Blitz
I get on today and the servers are down. The servers come back on and the scoring is all screwed up. Flames notes are only giving half of what they use to. Who knows what else might have changed.

Basically unless someone fixes this there is no point to play this game again. There is no way any previous score can be passed with the scoring as it is now. It would be great if someone would fix this.



***QUICK LINKS TO OFFICIAL HMX RESPONSES***

Post #1 on 12/27
Post #2 on 12/27
Post #3 on 12/28
Post #4 on 12/31
Post #5 on 12/31 with questions
Post #6 with current status

Comments

  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    MaximusDM;4951625 said:
    They didn't announce the re-balancing of power-ups the first time either, they waited until users came here and posted their findings before acknowledging buffs. And even then, they didn't give exact value changes. That was up to the players to figure out.

    Did it ever occur to you that the servers went down BECAUSE they were making this change.
    I don't know how you can relate a server malfunction to completely changing the value of a power-up. It was done deliberately.

    Yes everything you mentioned accrued to me. However if you do some quick math you would realize that very few top scores could be beaten with this change. So if they have done this than they are not very smart. There would be no reason to play the game any longer.

    So its logic that tells me this was a mistake.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    lol Says the guy who creates an account today just to tell me that. I wonder what that says about someone like you? But than again I would expect nothing less from a Redskins fan. They are used to losing.
  • HeyRilesHeyRiles Besse's Girl
    edited December 2012
    I'm assuming there is a post that was initially there that you replied to and then was deleted because otherwise this thread just went totally sane
  • www1221www1221 StackOverflowError
    edited December 2012
    HeyRiles;4951663 said:
    I'm assuming there is a post that was initially there that you replied to and then was deleted because otherwise this thread just went totally sane

    Yup there was a post here calling Cowboys a nerd and said nobody cared about him and ended it with him yelling about the Redskins and the Cowboys.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    HeyRiles;4951663 said:
    I'm assuming there is a post that was initially there that you replied to and then was deleted because otherwise this thread just went totally sane

    Yes it looks the Mods have deleted it. My first experience on these forums and it's nice to see these forums are well moderated.
  • SirDavidTLynchSirDavidTLynch Headliner
    edited December 2012
    It was somebody with just one post saying "lol loser posting this is pointless because HMX aren't going to do anything" or something like that. When the trolling is that obvious, it's best to just report it and move on.
  • HeyRilesHeyRiles Besse's Girl
    edited December 2012
    cowboys282;4951668 said:
    Yes it looks the Mods have deleted it. My first experience on these forums and it's nice to see these forums are well moderated.

    Well it's not like they can catch every picture involving bananas around here
  • Mircosoft93Mircosoft93 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    please reset the leaderboards
  • HeyRilesHeyRiles Besse's Girl
    edited December 2012
    Is there a way to, like, reset the leaderboards, but not delete our star count? Because all I've cared about lately is my gold star count
  • singemfrcsingemfrc Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    At this point they really need to reset the leaderboards. As bad as it might seem to those (like me) who have played a lot of unique songs, it's better than leaving scores on the leaderboards which are now unattainable.

    There are a couple songs (Child In Time, Madness) which after the update are now probably not possible to get gold stars on. (Bonus for me since Ive played so many songs they will soon delete my star data in game and I wont be able to get it back due to this update! Yay!)

    As a result of this the scoring system is now a complete snafu. They need to also fix the bandmate/flame exploit and then reset the leaderboards. Only then will I have any desire to play this game again.
  • ArandomrbplayerArandomrbplayer Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    3 words; this is bull.

    I don't like this change, not one bit. Yes, more blast notes are added in but SERIOUSLY? Flame notes were relied on for getting high scores, and now with the value of the Flame Notes decrease, not only is it going to be hard , if not flat out IMPOSSIBLE to gold star some songs (The Complexity of Light, Child in Time), but unless you are a god at Pinball, TONS of scores will now be broken, and impossible to beat. There's only two options I want from this, either they change it back to the way it was before, or they reset the leaderboards (which will piss a lot of people off considering it might have taken ages for them to get a 1st place), and they change some of the cutoffs on some songs to compensate for this change.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    Mircosoft93;4951678 said:
    please reset the leaderboards

    Unfortunately they will have to reset the leaderboards if they nerfed this on purpose. Most scores can not be passed now with any build. I should know as I cannot pass any of my own scores which are on the top of the songs I play.

    If this change stays and they do not reset the leaderboards there is no point to play the game anymore. People play to pass their high scores. Now its not possible.

    They should have left it they way it was. No matter what the power ups do the same people will be on the top of the boards. You do not get to the top because you are the only one using Flame notes. Everyone can use them. You get to the top by being good.
  • Mircosoft93Mircosoft93 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    cowboys282;4951704 said:
    They should have left it they way it was.
    no, they shouldn't. I'm happy they did something against the band/flame exploit. I don't even care if there are now songs that are nearly impossible to GS (CiT, Tuesdays Gone...), but as you've said already many scores are now basically unbeatable (except maybe with pinball/sync) and highscore hunting is the only thing that motivates me to play Blitz
  • MasterMoMasterMo Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    So, I guess I probably have to take a large part of the blame for this, huh?

    I'll be the first to admit that flame notes were ridiculously overpowered. Be it bandmate or jackpot as a companion to it, they were pretty much the best option on almost every song. So I, and many other, used flame notes. Is that not what we are supposed to do? Is the point of the game not to get the highest score possible?

    So now flame notes have been nerfed. I have not played the game since this change occured, and probably won't tonight, but it seems like flame notes are now pretty worthless. Now, I'm probably a bit biased, but was this drastic a nerf necessary to fix the perceived problem? Is this at all the best way to go about fixing it?

    The power ups were not balanced, and this change doesn't fix that. The best note powerup is now going to be blast notes, because lord knows runaway notes are worthless and pinball is too volatile to be used well consistently. Overdrive powerups like bottle rocket or even road rage pale in comparison to jackpot. So what does this change fix? Something needed to be changed, sure, but that change should have come as buffs to other powerups and blitz mode.

    Yeah, it's possible to mash with bandmate/flame to get good scores. The thing is, no one seemed to be doing that. I got good at bandmate/flame legitimately, and I've posted a number of videos that I hope proves that. This nerf changes that, but in the meantime makes most of the top scores, obtained legitimately, completely unbreakable. Maybe you question the idea of "two notes, one timing window" as legitimate play, but this nerf doesn't fix that, and the new top scores are still going to be ones that can utilize that strategy to accumulate extra overdrive and hit extra notes.

    So what do you do about the leaderboards? Do you reset them entirely and punish everyone including those who did nothing "wrong?" Do you reset just people like me and send a middle finger to long-time customers because you don't like the way they learned to play the game? Either way, you piss off a lot of people, more than you make happy with this change.

    This seems like a knee-jerk reaction to a situation that is perceived as worse than it really was.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    Mircosoft93;4951713 said:
    no, they shouldn't. I'm happy they did something against the band/flame exploit. I don't even care if there are now songs that are nearly impossible to GS (CiT, Tuesdays Gone...), but as you've said already many scores are now basically unbeatable (except maybe with pinball/sync) and highscore hunting is the only thing that motivates me to play Blitz

    If they did this to fix the Bandmate/Flame expliot thats one thing but it destroyed the best combo in the game. That was Jackpot/Flame. Yes it was inconsistent but you still needed skill to get a top score using that combo.

    The fix is simple yet probably complicated for Harmonix to do. Flame notes should not be random but consistent. That takes the luck out of it and leaves it to pure skill.

    But if they are going to nerf the Flames they need to reset the leaderboards because like you the only reason to play is to get the high score. To many high scores are now no longer possible.

    The Bandmate/Flame affected so few songs. I just don't understand the logic in this decision.
  • S1ckH4ndsS1ckH4nds YouTube Guru
    edited December 2012
    Yeah... I'm pretty much done with this as well then if that's a) intentional and b) permanent. I've played just about all the songs in my library, have held on to a first overall slot on the leaderboards for most of the time, and don't really have much incentive to go back and replay the songs to try to get higher scores when it'll be impossible now that flame notes give just over 1/5th of their previous value.

    Hope you fix it, guys.
  • PedroRVDPedroRVD Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    So, if they reset the leaderboards...and somebody somehow finds another exploit, will everybody be asking for the leaderboards to be wiped out again?

    This is not the right thing to do.

    PLEASE DON'T DO IT.
  • zage1337zage1337 Rising Star
    edited December 2012
    PedroRVD;4951738 said:
    So, if they reset the leaderboards...and somebody somehow finds another exploit, will everybody be asking for the leaderboards to be wiped out again?

    This is not the right thing to do.

    PLEASE DON'T DO IT.

    Either they rebuff flame notes to 1.5k points each again or they reset the leaderboards completely. They can't leave it like this where many of the top scores are impossible to beat and the entire leaderboards are completely worthless now.

    I'd rather have all the scores on the leaderboards be after the patch if they really insist on the flame note nerf. Otherwise revert flame notes to their original value. Flame notes are completely worthless now. They are even worse than Runaway Notes.
  • NightmareLyreNightmareLyre Rising Star
    edited December 2012
    Well this is just silly. Just happy I am such a noob that I only use Road Rage/Blast Notes most of the time, but still this is very silly.
  • Mircosoft93Mircosoft93 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    cowboys282;4951721 said:
    If they did this to fix the Bandmate/Flame expliot thats one thing but it destroyed the best combo in the game. That was Jackpot/Flame. Yes it was inconsistent but you still needed skill to get a top score using that combo.

    The fix is simple yet probably complicated for Harmonix to do. Flame notes should not be random but consistent. That takes the luck out of it and leaves it to pure skill.

    But if they are going to nerf the Flames they need to reset the leaderboards because like you the only reason to play is to get the high score. To many high scores are now no longer possible.

    The Bandmate/Flame affected so few songs. I just don't understand the logic in this decision.

    Jack/blast needs skill too, pinball/sync needs skill as well
    I used jack/flame all the time it's just a matter of getting used to new power-up combos, I mean, wouldn't it be ideal if there are lots of power-up combos to choose for getting high scores, that's the reason why HMX put that many power-ups in the game in the first place I guess. This nerf might be helpful then.

    On a side note I find it funny how MasterMo is the guy moaning the most
  • MasterMoMasterMo Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    You have an odd idea of what moaning looks like, my friend. That's criticism of a decision that I don't think was a wise one. Certainly, I have a lot to lose in regards to the nerf and what happens to my leaderboard scores, but at the end of the day it's just a video game. If HMX decides/has decided they don't like the way I play their game and want to ensure I can't do that any longer, then so be it. I'll find another game to spend my time and money on.
  • SirDavidTLynchSirDavidTLynch Headliner
    edited December 2012
    Wiping the leaderboards make things worse for 99% of people who only pay attention to friends leaderboards, if that, and even the hardcore players aren't going to get #1 on every song. That's just impossible.

    I'm hoping this is accidental and/or reversed, because it changed the game from button-mashing as the only way to win a score war with someone who does the same to button-mashing as the only way to get any use out of flame notes.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    Mircosoft93;4951746 said:
    Jack/blast needs skill too, pinball/sync needs skill as well
    I used jack/flame all the time it's just a matter of getting used to new power-up combos, I mean, wouldn't it be ideal if there are lots of power-up combos to choose for getting high scores, that's the reason why HMX put that many power-ups in the game in the first place I guess. This nerf might be helpful then.

    On a side note I find it funny how MasterMo is the guy moaning the most

    I agree. Jack/Blast was my combo for awhile early on. I got to the top on many songs using it. The problem was as more people played with Jack/Flame and got good flame runs the scores got too high. If they reset the leaderboards that will be the best combo.

    But I can assure you everyone of my scores I beat using Jack/Flames over Jack/Blast and I am sure you have as well. And although Jack/Blast does take skill Jack/Flame is always more challenging.

    And yes the little I hear of MasterMo he seems to be very high on himself. However everything he posted was 100% right except for maybe his first statement.
  • PedroRVDPedroRVD Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    So...if HMX decides/has decided they don't like how I have spent 500 hours in their game to reach #1 on the leaderboard, then so be it. I'll find another game to spend my time and money on.

    ...

    People are overeacting to this...but, well...maybe HMX should not try to rebalance the game anymore, that will always bring more problems than before.

    Maybe they should post a group of alternative solutions to this problem without reseting anything (including nerfing flame) that are actually possible to implement, and let people here vote.
  • NightmareLyreNightmareLyre Rising Star
    edited December 2012
    Mircosoft93;4951746 said:

    On a side note I find it funny how MasterMo is the guy moaning the most
    cowboys282;4951758 said:

    And yes the little I hear of MasterMo he seems to be very high on himself. However everything he posted was 100% right except for maybe his first statement.

    I kind of get a "he don't like what we like so he is whining" vibe from these comments. MasterMo have reacted pretty reasonably to all this I would say, being upset but still being calm and presenting his outlook in a rather mature way. I wish more people could complain like MasterMo, less caps lock and bad grammar that way.
  • Mircosoft93Mircosoft93 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    cowboys282;4951758 said:
    I agree. Jack/Blast was my combo for awhile early on. I got to the top on many songs using it. The problem was as more people played with Jack/Flame and got good flame runs the scores got too high. If they reset the leaderboards that will be the best combo.

    But I can assure you everyone of my scores I beat using Jack/Flames over Jack/Blast and I am sure you have as well. And although Jack/Blast does take skill Jack/Flame is always more challenging.

    And yes the little I hear of MasterMo he seems to be very high on himself. However everything he posted was 100% right except for maybe his first statement.


    I agree that it requires more skill and mostly results in a better score than jack/blast but it was OP. band/flame was OP too and nerfing flame notes was maybe not the best solution but a very efficient one. The only issue I have is with not reseting the leaderboards. And I understand why ppl don't like that, I spent hundreds of hours in Blitz too but in the long term it's the best they can do
  • lemonsquaredlemonsquared Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    whats the point of trying to top the leaderboards if they are going to change the rules constantly.

    There is so many things one could say about this, but honestly its not worth my time. I am done with blitz
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    NightmareLyre;4951763 said:
    I kind of get a "he don't like what we like so he is whining" vibe from these comments. MasterMo have reacted pretty reasonably to all this I would say, being upset but still being calm and presenting his outlook in a rather mature way. I wish more people could complain like MasterMo, less caps lock and bad grammar that way.
    I guess you missed the part where I said he was 100% right even though you quoted me saying that? The only thing I disagreed with was his statement saying he was the biggest reason why this happened. Although I know (I hope) he was being tongue and cheek.

    FYI neither me or Microsoft93 have used caps in any of our posts and although I have not proofread any of my posts I am confident in the grammar. I think you have me confused with someone else.
  • cowboys282cowboys282 Unsigned
    edited December 2012
    lemonsquared;4951784 said:
    whats the point of trying to top the leaderboards if they are going to change the rules constantly.

    There is so many things one could say about this, but honestly its not worth my time. I am done with blitz

    You are right on lemonsquare. Not only does it defeat the purpose of playing when they randomly change the game and tell no one but the change makes the current scores impossible to beat.

    I am baffled by this decision which is why I can only rationalize this as a mistake. If these people understood the community in their game they would have never done this. A decision like this would prove how out of touch they are with their own game. A decision like this goes against everything they have done previously. Which is why this has to be a mistake.
  • MaximusDMMaximusDM Opening Act
    edited December 2012
    MasterMo;4951719 said:
    So, I guess I probably have to take a large part of the blame for this, huh?
    No. If anyone to blame is Harmonix's coders/testers for not picking up how to score by their own set of rules.
    MasterMo;4951719 said:
    Something needed to be changed, sure, but that change should have come as buffs to other powerups and blitz mode.
    Bingo.
    As far as I'm concerned, they can buff until the cows come home. They can double point values every year to have people coming back to replay stuff if they so chose. Either way, leaderboardboards scores would always be obtainable by anyone.
    MasterMo;4951719 said:
    ...new top scores are still going to be ones that can utilize that strategy to accumulate extra overdrive and hit extra notes.
    Correct.
    Juggling lanes is an important part of Blitz no matter WHAT loadout you use. By playing 2 lanes, you are going to potentially get double the amount of points you normally would. I guess Harmonix thought this was the easy fix?
    cowboys282;4951721 said:
    The Bandmate/Flame affected so few songs. I just don't understand the logic in this decision.
    That's grossly inaccurate. As I've grown better at juggling lanes I've pushed into mid-tier songs and beyond and held solid flame note juggles. Its really only faster more note-dense songs or songs with very little of a particular instrument that couldn't be used with bandmate/flame.
    Mircosoft93;4951746 said:

    I used jack/flame all the time it's just a matter of getting used to new power-up combos
    Well you won't anymore, no one will. Jack/Blast seems to be the far better option now. With Blast notes apparently getting a buff. And flame notes + jackpot was the ultimate risk reward. After this. There is absolutely no reward for your risk. In fact, your extreme risk and flame luck might not even break you even with jackpot/blast.
    Mircosoft93;4951746 said:
    I mean, wouldn't it be ideal if there are lots of power-up combos to choose for getting high scores, that's the reason why HMX put that many power-ups in the game in the first place I guess.
    There kind of are. I'm not sure how well button mashing flame chains gets you in faster more note dense songs for the most part, it can't be done legitly without flailing. And that's when I turn to different loadouts. Or as I mentioned, many 5 lane songs. Or songs with very spaced out instrument notation.
    Mircosoft93;4951746 said:
    On a side note I find it funny how MasterMo is the guy moaning the most
    wat

    He is equally concerned with illegit bandmate/flame abuse. But he and I agree, this was not the proper solution.
    MasterMo;4951756 said:
    If HMX decides/has decided they don't like the way I play their game and want to ensure I can't do that any longer, then so be it. I'll find another game to spend my time and money on.
    I'm right there with you man. And its not to punish Harmonix. Its not to boycott them for this decision. Its a matter of not being able to compete on leaderboards anymore using my chosen playstyle. I too no longer have interest in Blitz anymore. Perhaps I will be spending more time on RB3 as I have been neglecting it since Blitz. However XMB gets old REAL quick. My patience had really run its course with it and Blitz was certainly a breath of fresh air, minus many, many, Rock Central shenanigans not accepting my score after a 2112 run to name one.
    cowboys282;4951758 said:
    But I can assure you everyone of my scores I beat using Jack/Flames over Jack/Blast and I am sure you have as well. And although Jack/Blast does take skill Jack/Flame is always more challenging.
    Isn't that kind of the point? More challenge/skill based loadouts should reward in higher scores. Jackpot/Flame is now worthless. If you don't believe it then try it for yourself. 9/10, you are better off using jackpot/blast. All the skill/reflex/lane juggling you've learned to become accustom to now goes unrewarded. As your playstyle has now become worthless in the eyes of the leaderboard.
    You can argue that bandmate/flamenotes don't take any skill. Perhaps they don't when you button spam. But EVERYONE can agree on that. This was not the solution to that problem.
    cowboys282;4951758 said:
    And yes the little I hear of MasterMo he seems to be very high on himself.
    wat
    Mircosoft93;4951774 said:
    I agree that it requires more skill and mostly results in a better score than jack/blast but it was OP. band/flame was OP too and nerfing flame notes was maybe not the best solution but a very efficient one. The only issue I have is with not reseting the leaderboards. And I understand why ppl don't like that, I spent hundreds of hours in Blitz too but in the long term it's the best they can do
    It was overpowered. Nerfing ANYTHING is never the solution in the case of this game. Its score/leaderboard based. There are buffs to be had, penalties that could of been played for abuse. They went for an easy fix, and it broke the leaderboards.
    For them to wipe leaderboards is crazy.
    Crazy. They didn't wipe drum leaderboards when people found out about those notes underneath the drum fills. I don't expect them to wipe leaderboards. They will stay that way until it is rebuffed, if ever. With hundreds if not thousands of unobtainable scores.
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