We demand online matchmaking and multiple instruments per console!

Comments

  • edited October 25
    *facepalm* @speculation :|

    sell the game and move on...?
  • jaystonepkjaystonepk Opening Act
    If RB4 and its perceived lack of development is causing you this much disappointment and disdain why do you keep coming back only to be disappointed and disdained repeatedly? It some point it just can't be worth it from a personal level since, in your eyes, this game will never be what you want it to be.
  • edited October 26
    dlchief58 said:


    Had they made a product matching the quality of previous games at launch, they probably wouldn't be in the current situation. I came back here hoping to see something promising for the future, but was only met with further disappointment which should be the sub-title of this game.

    In previous games they were published by EA and had a ton more money to spend developing the game. Now that they are a small Indy company, and the popularity of these games have shrunk drastically, they needed a different approach on how they would continue supporting and improving the game.

    No one is denying that the game was bare bone when first released, but they were pretty open about that and kept a promise that they would keep patching and improving the game in the future - they certainly have. The game today is not even recognizable from their first release, and we can definitely say that they have surpassed even RB3 on many fronts.
  • @LoopyChew has it done well.
  • dlchief58dlchief58 Opening Act
    LoopyChew said:

    Look, @dlchief cares about the game, even if all he seems to do is complain. He has legitimate points about what the game is versus what it used to be and I do find myself wishing there were more to the game.

    That said, Chief, people are enjoying this game on its own merits and stop thinking you’re above those sheep, because you very clearly think those of us who enjoy the game are suckers. It’s not that we don’t miss things like more than one player per console and keys (obviously, since we’re on a thread about the former and you were a very active participant on the thread about the latter), it’s that we’ve accepted these as reality and hope that some of this stuff gets addressed as time goes by.

    Furthermore, if you keep treating Harmonix like they’re some sort of antagonist in an episode of Leverage and are cheering for its demise, that’s just being a jerk, and won’t be tolerated. Stick with complaints but don’t cross that line ever again.

    As per multiple instruments per console, I presume (user hat) that it’s simply too difficult time- and cost-wise for them to implement (and test) it properly. There’s a LOT of things that need to be tested (I’ve gone on at length about the kinds of things that they need to figure out beforehand, and since I’m working off of a limited internet connection I can’t find it right now) and since (as I hope everyone has realized by now) they had to rebuild RB4 from the ground up, even if they have a logic they can follow from the previous games it takes a LOT to make sure whatever code they’re working on follows that logic.

    Okay! Twenty-four hours into my trip and already annoyed by the internet. Maybe I should appreciate only having limited access.

    Loopy, thanks for the few words of support there - I wouldn't be writing this if I didn't care about the game and its health. Just to clarify, I was in no way cheering for the demise of Harmonix but rather stating that many of their decisions this generation may lead them down that road. They need to do something as they are definitely not growing the game with their current approach and have already alienated several other portions of their once loyal fans, so no new business there. And had it not been for Kal-El's snide, sarcastic comment I wouldn't have even gone there. I let his snarkiness get to me. That and still being very displeased at how they have handled this game since announced, both feature wise and how they repeatedly fumble communication with their base (to put it kindly).

    I guess its OK that many of you enjoy the game for what it is, but you should be demanding better and not settling. Someone needs to keep them on their toes and demand they significantly up their game if they want to continue and grow the franchise, something that will never happen if they keep the same customers who are OK with less than they had before, as they too will gradually whither away. I had hope at one time, Harmonix crushed it significantly with the launch, their backtracking on many pre-launch statements and nearly every following announcement that diminished expectations. I guess there was still a glimmer left, but that too led to disappointment after seeing the current roadmap and announcements. Being in a room full of cheerleaders giving out atta-boys is not going to instigate any change or significant improvement, there needs to be some critics to push them to greater things.

    I apologize if anyone was offended by the "sucker" comment, but honestly how could anyone have been happy PAYING for the online solution they presented? As I said, I feel sorry for anyone who bit on that hoping there would have been a decent implementation of online play instead of what was released. If that was all they were going to do, they might as well had just made that a patch to the regular game and been ashamed to put it behind a paywall. Then people praising them for thinking about finally adding a lobby system just got my goat, as that has been around for 20 years and actually would have been superior to what they released with Rivals. And let's make this clear, I would have had no problem paying for NEW features in Rivals (had I not been actively boycotting all things about this game) but do have an issue with paying for a standard feature from past games, much less one stripped down as what was released, regardless if they bundled it with the rest. I just find that shady and underhanded, I am sure many of you may disagree.

    So let's be clear, I do not think the game is terrible or faulty, just still severely lacking in many regards (and sounds like it will remain that way). A lot of those were features I and other were passionate about, yet we were casually discarded as our input and money made no difference to them. I do still occasionally play a game or two, mostly when the grandkids visit, but there is little to keep me engaged anymore with no keys, no pro instruments and a hamstringed online system locked behind a paywall. I probably would have had no issue paying for Rivals alone without online play functionality locked in there, but I have principles and cannot support that practice. Had that been properly handled, they likely would have regained me and many others as customers for this game with that simple act of good faith. That is a shame as I see the DLC has recently improved greatly in my opinion with many I would have considered for purchase had things gone differently.

    Anyway, sorry I rambled on so long and likely covered many points I have already addressed in other posts. For the record, I am not complaining but criticizing in hopes for something good to come from it. They'll likely never reach the standards I feel they should meet based on their roadmap, but hopefully my criticisms can improve the game more for the rest of you. Try not to take it personally.
  • kal_el_0724kal_el_0724 Opening Act
    dlchief58 said:

    LoopyChew said:

    Look, @dlchief cares about the game, even if all he seems to do is complain. He has legitimate points about what the game is versus what it used to be and I do find myself wishing there were more to the game.

    That said, Chief, people are enjoying this game on its own merits and stop thinking you’re above those sheep, because you very clearly think those of us who enjoy the game are suckers. It’s not that we don’t miss things like more than one player per console and keys (obviously, since we’re on a thread about the former and you were a very active participant on the thread about the latter), it’s that we’ve accepted these as reality and hope that some of this stuff gets addressed as time goes by.

    Furthermore, if you keep treating Harmonix like they’re some sort of antagonist in an episode of Leverage and are cheering for its demise, that’s just being a jerk, and won’t be tolerated. Stick with complaints but don’t cross that line ever again.

    As per multiple instruments per console, I presume (user hat) that it’s simply too difficult time- and cost-wise for them to implement (and test) it properly. There’s a LOT of things that need to be tested (I’ve gone on at length about the kinds of things that they need to figure out beforehand, and since I’m working off of a limited internet connection I can’t find it right now) and since (as I hope everyone has realized by now) they had to rebuild RB4 from the ground up, even if they have a logic they can follow from the previous games it takes a LOT to make sure whatever code they’re working on follows that logic.

    Okay! Twenty-four hours into my trip and already annoyed by the internet. Maybe I should appreciate only having limited access.

    I guess its OK that many of you enjoy the game for what it is, but you should be demanding better and not settling.
    Demanding is not the correct way to go about it. There would be no fan base left if we were just all demanding things left and right.

    However, what we do is request. They listen to our feedback and we listen to theirs. The only way we have a chance at getting what we would like is by continuing to support them. It has shown that that method bodes well for both us (the community) and them (Harmonix). With what they currently have slated for the near future is yet another good step in the right direction. And pending on the outlook after that, with our support, maybe we will get another expansion next year with some highly requested features.

    Only time will tell. But through the proverbial fire and flames, I'm going to keep supporting them because I know how loyal they are to their base.
  • And we need to keep in mind it is a limited budget, and most of that goes to lawyers and licensing.

    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.
  • ekffazrekffazr Unsigned

    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    I don't want more and better, I just want multiple instruments per console online. Just one thing, this should be the only thing in the budget, everything else is fluff
  • RyoandrRyoandr Opening Act

    And we need to keep in mind it is a limited budget, and most of that goes to lawyers and licensing.

    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    Then they need to be clear about what their budget allows.
    Literally everything is "Maybe" at this point, and has been for 2 years. Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...
  • LoopyChewLoopyChew Wordsmith
    Ryoandr said:

    And we need to keep in mind it is a limited budget, and most of that goes to lawyers and licensing.

    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    Then they need to be clear about what their budget allows.
    Literally everything is "Maybe" at this point, and has been for 2 years. Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...
    The thing is, I doubt they have a budget for the *entire* RB lifecycle, probably just for the next X months (e.g. through 2018) or maybe just the next feature release). So it’s always “maybe” because it’s “not now.”
  • SmashManSmashMan Rising Star
    Ryoandr said:

    Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...

    Stage kit is as clear a no as Harmonix comes without actually saying no. There was nothing ambiguous or open-ended about the way they addressed it on the stream.
  • LoopyChewLoopyChew Wordsmith
    SmashMan said:

    Ryoandr said:

    Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...

    Stage kit is as clear a no as Harmonix comes without actually saying no. There was nothing ambiguous or open-ended about the way they addressed it on the stream.
    And yet there’s a reason they don’t say “no:” because it’s not a definitive, close-the-book “no.” That’s why Derek clarified the statement in the corresponding thread:
    HMXOwl said:

    It's the same answer we've had for the last year, everyone. We're not working on it. We could later if we so choose. No one said 'definite no' except for fan interpretation.

  • TheRainbowTroutsTheRainbowTrouts Opening Act
    edited November 1
    LoopyChew said:

    SmashMan said:

    Ryoandr said:

    Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...

    Stage kit is as clear a no as Harmonix comes without actually saying no. There was nothing ambiguous or open-ended about the way they addressed it on the stream.
    And yet there’s a reason they don’t say “no:” because it’s not a definitive, close-the-book “no.” That’s why Derek clarified the statement in the corresponding thread:
    HMXOwl said:

    It's the same answer we've had for the last year, everyone. We're not working on it. We could later if we so choose. No one said 'definite no' except for fan interpretation.

    It's still a no though as Smashman originally described. Not an outright no like keyboards, more like a no to a RB3 styled character creator. There's little point waiting around for any of these 3 features.
  • grumblevolcanogrumblevolcano Headliner
    edited November 1
    ekffazr said:


    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    I don't want more and better, I just want multiple instruments per console online. Just one thing, this should be the only thing in the budget, everything else is fluff
    The issue with multiple instruments per console online may be a 1st party issue like Microsoft not allowing the RB4 and Rivals instruments to have headphone jacks or Sony not allowing cross platform online play rather than a HMX issue.
  • ekffazrekffazr Unsigned

    ekffazr said:


    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    I don't want more and better, I just want multiple instruments per console online. Just one thing, this should be the only thing in the budget, everything else is fluff
    The issue with multiple instruments per console online may be a 1st party issue like Microsoft not allowing the RB4 and Rivals instruments to have headphone jacks or Sony not allowing cross platform online play rather than a HMX issue.
    it may be that or it may be something else or it may be nothing
    then I wish they would say something......anything.

    "hey all, we know you want this but so far we haven't been able to make it happen due to some technical issues"
    or
    "hey sorry this is not on our roadmap at all in the future"
    or
    "hey everyone, this is something we may look at down the road, but not in the coming year"
    or
    "hey you know what, we are actually seeing what can be done here"

    I know they read these threads, but they don't acknowledge this even exists or that we even care about it. its like a ghost thread that only non hmx people can see. just looking for hmx to acknowledge

    sometimes I ask too much though
  • LoopyChewLoopyChew Wordsmith

    ekffazr said:


    Yes we all want more and better things, but being realistic with expectations is also important. Request away, but demanding things, especially things that take a good chunk of budget, isn't the way to go.

    I don't want more and better, I just want multiple instruments per console online. Just one thing, this should be the only thing in the budget, everything else is fluff
    The issue with multiple instruments per console online may be a 1st party issue like Microsoft not allowing the RB4 and Rivals instruments to have headphone jacks or Sony not allowing cross platform online play rather than a HMX issue.
    Doubtful. I can’t imagine controller limitations being an issue with cross local/network multiplayer.
  • SmashManSmashMan Rising Star
    LoopyChew said:

    SmashMan said:

    Ryoandr said:

    Heck even the stage kit support went back to "Maybe"...

    Stage kit is as clear a no as Harmonix comes without actually saying no. There was nothing ambiguous or open-ended about the way they addressed it on the stream.
    And yet there’s a reason they don’t say “no:” because it’s not a definitive, close-the-book “no.” That’s why Derek clarified the statement in the corresponding thread:
    HMXOwl said:

    It's the same answer we've had for the last year, everyone. We're not working on it. We could later if we so choose. No one said 'definite no' except for fan interpretation.

    I don't think that goes against anything I said. Aside from keyboard support when they were surprisingly clear, Harmonix has trouble saying no, opting for a "never say never!" or "maybe one day!" approach. That's fine early on, but two years after release? Sometimes things are just no, and that's fine too.

    Sussman's statements on the stage kit in the stream didn't really need Derek's further clarification here, though even that clarification could have ended after "We're not working on it." The sentences after it do nothing but give those few people still wanting support for it something to cling to when their hopes could be better spent elsewhere.
  • rkbdgurlrkbdgurl Road Warrior
    Sometimes hope is all ya got. I remember when we were all just holding on to the hope that Rock Band would come out with a new game....or that dlc would make a comeback...so for those who refuse to give up hope. You have my full support. ....even if there isn't a snowballs chance in Arizona that you'll get what you want, Never give up!
    ;)
  • ekffazrekffazr Unsigned
    rkbdgurl said:

    even if there isn't a snowballs chance in Arizona that you'll get what you want, Never give up!
    ;)

    it snows in flagstaff sometimes :smile:

  • SmashManSmashMan Rising Star
    rkbdgurl said:

    Sometimes hope is all ya got. I remember when we were all just holding on to the hope that Rock Band would come out with a new game....or that dlc would make a comeback...so for those who refuse to give up hope. You have my full support. ....even if there isn't a snowballs chance in Arizona that you'll get what you want, Never give up!
    ;)

    I'm not as anti-hope as the wording in my previous post reads, haha. It's just...they're not going to support a non-essential nine year old peripheral two years into their latest entry's life cycle. It's okay for them to just say that sometimes.
  • @SmashMan I think external factors are why HMX won't say no outright.

    Think about Master Chief Collection for example, 343 stopped trying to fix the game in 2015 as a result of reaching a somewhat stable compromise where trying to fix more of the bugs would seem to break other parts of the game. Then very recently, 343 announced that they're returning to fixing Master Chief Collection in Spring 2018 because the new XB1 OS (October 2017 update) and XB1X are allowing them to overcome those issues.

  • ekffazr said:

    rkbdgurl said:

    even if there isn't a snowballs chance in Arizona that you'll get what you want, Never give up!
    ;)

    it snows in flagstaff sometimes :smile:

    "The annual snowfall averages 100.3 inches (254.76 cm), placing Flagstaff among the snowiest incorporated cities in the United States. Overall, the city features an average of 277 days without measurable precipitation each year."

    I'd say that's a lot of snowballs in Arizona.

  • I've been to Flagstaff during the winter, can confirm there is a lot of snow

    There is also a lot of other places that get snow too, while there is almost none in Tucson, Mt. Lemon (which is like an hour away) has a good ski resort that opens in the winter

    but yeah a better saying would be a "snowball's chance in Tucson, or Phoenix, or Yuma, or Nogales, or many other southern cities"
  • I'm calling tsunami's chance in Indiana as far as the metaphors go.
  • bonethug0108bonethug0108 Headliner
    edited November 4
    New Orleans gets snow sometimes. And by sometimes I mean about once every 15 years or so.

    https://www.currentresults.com/Weather/Louisiana/annual-snowfall.php
  • LordFlatusLordFlatus Rising Star
    I think HMX's answer to the SK is perfect and appropriate. I don't know how you can misinterpret "We're not working on it, but that doesn't mean we won't ever work on it."

    So I love the stage kit, and had plenty of smoky lit-up RB2 and RB3 parties. I would love the SK to return to RB4, but I am not looking for it in the current update or anytime in the future. But there is a chance down the road that HMX will chime in and say "Hey, guess what?"
  • While this was kind of already detailed in the roadmap stream, the November update blog post had a section on the early 2018 update:

    "Before I get to the meat of this update, I want to remind you that we’ve got more coming in early 2018. In addition to a super strong DLC schedule (you’ll see!), we’re working on an update designed to add some long-awaited functionality to Online Quickplay. We’re still building it, so there isn’t too much to say right now, but the major takeaway is that we’re getting rid of the constraint where you can only play with console friends and building out some host and join functions that make it much easier to find people to play with – people with similar play styles, DLC song count, and more. Online Quickplay will be getting a major overhaul. We will definitely have more to say about this as our development process progresses, so please stay tuned!"

    http://www.harmonixmusic.com/blog/rock-band-4-november-update-now-live/
  • While this was kind of already detailed in the roadmap stream, the November update blog post had a section on the early 2018 update:

    "Before I get to the meat of this update, I want to remind you that we’ve got more coming in early 2018. In addition to a super strong DLC schedule (you’ll see!), we’re working on an update designed to add some long-awaited functionality to Online Quickplay. We’re still building it, so there isn’t too much to say right now, but the major takeaway is that we’re getting rid of the constraint where you can only play with console friends and building out some host and join functions that make it much easier to find people to play with – people with similar play styles, DLC song count, and more. Online Quickplay will be getting a major overhaul. We will definitely have more to say about this as our development process progresses, so please stay tuned!"

    http://www.harmonixmusic.com/blog/rock-band-4-november-update-now-live/

    Reminder then to stay tuned for the REAL progress to start next year, gotcha XD
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